Extremely disappointed in this org

@Vikingr• 16/04/2024

Extremely disappointed in this org

Sam Matthews just confirmed that fnatic will be taking part in the esports World Cup and help the Saudi regime with their sports washing efforts. This is a massive slap in the face of the fan base especially the lgbtq+ and I’m honestly disgusted that they even considered going in the first place.

I expected much better from this org and I hope the fans will boycott this event as it is nothing but a sports washing sham to cover human rights abuses done by the Saudi regime.

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A Z I Z@DinzX• last Wednesday at 15:21

Loading...As a Saudi Arabian myself, and having read your replies and complaining and seeing you all over the place and rotting in hatred, i say this: Keep up the good work. Love seeing you crying like this. Now stop watching Saudi eSports events and let the team do what is beneficial for it.

heny

@heny• 21/04/2024

Loading...It would just be virtue signalling. I get where you're coming from. No country is perfect. Instead of just blindly just asking for a boycott. Why not see it as an opportunity? to enlighten them. To show them "you're doing well for our sports we want you to do well in order areas" You can't end hate with more hate On the note of Islam killing LGBT people that's extreme and I'm sure it goes against their religion. It's an extreme measure to preserve their values. I don't support killing LGBT people but I believe countries have the right to refuse same sex marriage and use religion as law. You cannot fix hate with more hate.

Franky

@Franky• 21/04/2024

Loading...@heny Nobody's claiming any country is perfect; we're talking about basic human rights violations here. And then you come in with your white savior complex, suggesting that somehow we're going to enlighten them. It's condescending and simply doesn't work. Furthermore, Vikingr was referring to Saudi Arabia, not Islam. And we're discussing the execution of LGBT individuals, not just the denial of same-sex marriage. If you want to talk about other issues beyond LGBT rights, there's also the issue of slavery, violent repression of dissenting voices, and nearly non-existent women's rights. Let's not mix everything up.

KingofKingz

@nebukuro• 20/04/2024

Loading...Saudi also owns ESL and faceit. So if you are being consistent stop watching any ESL tournaments. Fanatic needs money and the tournament is a big opportunity. Not participating doesn't help anyone and only harms the org.

Vikingr

@Vikingr• 20/04/2024

Loading...@nebukuro I don’t watch anything ESL related or CS related anyways. Not participating sends a message that sports washing isn’t welcome in esports and should be shunned and shamed whenever presented. I’d rather orgs take a hit to their pockets than to their morals.

Catxalote@CATXALOTE• 18/04/2024

Loading...Wtf its not a political tournament its just money what an org needs to survive so for me its ok

Vikingr

@Vikingr• 18/04/2024

Loading...@CATXALOTE It’s funded by the Saudi government for the sole purpose of sports washing. It’s political whether you like it or not.

Rayo@Rayo• 17/04/2024

Loading...While I understand where you are coming from, I completely disagree with the last point you made. You respectfully need to keep in mind that it is not human rights abuse if it’s part of their religion to not support LGBTQ. The same thing happened during the world cup in Qatar, everyone was complaining yet it was one of the most successful world cups hosted. Every country has its laws that need to be respected and followed. And I do not see big organisations missing out on participating in such a huge event, that will be a loss.

Vikingr

@Vikingr• 17/04/2024

Loading...@Rayo I’m sorry but that is quite a terrible take. Just because someone’s religion says it’s okay to imprison and/or kill members of the lgbtq community then it’s not a human rights abuse? It’s still a human rights violation regardless what religion or law of country says. If a countries law/religion says that it’s okay to abuse women for simply being women then by ur logic it’s okay coz it’s the law or their religion. But it wouldn’t be because that is still a human rights violation. Religion and state should always be separate. I’m all for freedom of religion as long as it doesn’t infringe on the rights of others. Just because something is successful doesn’t mean it’s morally or ethically right to partake. It seems it’s fine to ignore these things as long as it lines your pockets and that’s absolutely disgusting

Franky

@Franky• 17/04/2024

Loading...@Rayo So firstly, there's a difference between not supporting and actively suppressing; here we're talking about imprisonment, torture, death penalty, and many other similar things. Secondly, if tomorrow my country decides that killing all blonde people is legal, it doesn't mean it ceases to be a violation of human rights. And finally, the success or failure of competitions or anything else in countries with similar laws doesn't make it a positive argument; it simply shows the power of money, which, to me, is rather negative.

Franky

@Franky• 17/04/2024

Loading...I agree it's really crappy to participate in these kinds of tournaments, but the reality is that it was obvious. We already participated in Gamers8, which also takes place in Saudi Arabia, so it was logical, and on top of that, there's a lot of money involved. It's sad because it goes against the values, I think Fnatic and his staff share. Honestly, from a purely cynical and business perspective, we can't not go, but I hope at least us the fans will boycott it

walnutsftw@walnutsftw• 16/04/2024

Loading...Your perspective is overly reductionist. Saudi Arabia has undergone significant progressiveness in recent years. How do you suppose such change occurs? Do you believe that the legalization of same-sex marriage in the UK and France happened overnight? Change requires time and effort. Let's not overlook the fact that the UK granted marriage rights to LGBTQ individuals just 11 years ago.

Vikingr

@Vikingr• 16/04/2024

Loading...@walnutsftw While yes it did take time for the uk etc to legalise gay marriage and other rights for lgbtq people they haven’t been imprisoning them or worse for simply existing. That’s not the only issue with how the Saudi regime conducts itself. Not the only human rights abuses they take part in. I implore you to look into it urself and see why I and many others are disgusting at this event

walnutsftw@walnutsftw• 16/04/2024

Loading...@walnutsftw @Vikingr You realise that UK chemically castrated and imprisoned thousands of homosexual men as little as 50 years ago, right? You realise that an estimated 60 000 gay men were convicted by French courts between 1942 and 1982 under homophobic laws, right? Do you have any issues with France taking the natural resources of Africa? Will you boycott Germany for refusing to make proper reparations for their genocide in Namibia? It's obviously wrong that Saudi Arabia has criminalized LGBTQ rights, but I think it's also wrong that your thinking is so black and white. They've shown a willingness to change, and I, for one, will give them a chance Perhaps you should take a moment to reflect on why you find it challenging to think critically.

Lahm

@Lahm• 17/04/2024

Loading...@walnutsftw Change, sure. Significant change? No way. I don't think this is an issue that can be talked about through a thread like this, so I'll just post a video that aligns with a lot of my beliefs and discusses the issues more in depth in a much easier format if you want to give it a chance. [youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GIilD9qAzeA[/youtube]